[Xrow]

I'm calling you on this right now. You have no f**king clue regarding my proposition of truth and its relativity and absoluteness. The two numbered events are stand alone, BOTH STRICTLY RELATING TO THE ****ING INDIVIDUAL ONLY. Yes, to you, it is absolute truth that I am going to hell because YOU belief it. It is also absolute truth that I am NOT going to hell BECAUSE I DON'T BELIEVE IT. So your saying that two mutually exclusive "truths" are both true at the same time? HOW CAN IT BE TRUE THAT YOU ARE GOING TO HELL AND ARE NOT GOING TO HELL AT THE SAME TIME?
You are confusing TRUTH with BELIEF, my friend. You must understand the difference before we may progress. Due to their conflicting nature, these two truths are LABELED AS RELATIVE. The reason they are labeled AS RELATIVE is because BOTH are unsubstantiated claims with regard to the opposing belief. This is simply a case of subjectivity vs. objectivity (another concept you are far from grasping).
Sigh. Opti, one is true regardless of whether you or I BELIEVE it to be true or not. You are either ABSOLUTELY GOING TO HELL, or you are ABSOLUTELY NOT GOING TO HELL.

As for mutually exclusivity, I understand this term and its implications completely. However, what I do not understand is the context in which you apply it. I still don't, as you are that logically UNSOUND.
You are volitionally blind. It cannot be absolutely true that you are going to hell, while at the same time being absolutely true that you are not going to hell. REGARDLESS OF EITHER OF OUR BELIEFS! Understand?

[Optimism]

I'm calling you on this right now. You have no f**king clue regarding my proposition of truth and its relativity and absoluteness. The two numbered events are stand alone, BOTH STRICTLY RELATING TO THE ****ING INDIVIDUAL ONLY. Yes, to you, it is absolute truth that I am going to hell because YOU belief it. It is also absolute truth that I am NOT going to hell BECAUSE I DON'T BELIEVE IT. So your saying that two mutually exclusive "truths" are both true at the same time? HOW CAN IT BE TRUE THAT YOU ARE GOING TO HELL AND ARE NOT GOING TO HELL AT THE SAME TIME?
You are confusing TRUTH with BELIEF, my friend. You must understand the difference before we may progress. Due to their conflicting nature, these two truths are LABELED AS RELATIVE. The reason they are labeled AS RELATIVE is because BOTH are unsubstantiated claims with regard to the opposing belief. This is simply a case of subjectivity vs. objectivity (another concept you are far from grasping).
Sigh. Opti, one is true regardless of whether you or I BELIEVE it to be true or not. You are either ABSOLUTELY GOING TO HELL, or you are ABSOLUTELY NOT GOING TO HELL.

As for mutually exclusivity, I understand this term and its implications completely. However, what I do not understand is the context in which you apply it. I still don't, as you are that logically UNSOUND.
You are volitionally blind. It cannot be absolutely true that you are going to hell, while at the same time being absolutely true that you are not going to hell. REGARDLESS OF EITHER OF OUR BELIEFS! Understand?

What if I were both places at once for all eternity?

\last ditch effort to convey understanding.

If you don't get it now, then a miracle must occur.

[Xrow]

Once again, you are confusing truth with belief.

Two mutually exclusive truths CANNOT be held at the same time.
Two mutually exclusive beliefs CAN be held at the same time.

I pity you.

[Optimism]

What if hell or heaven haven't been created yet. This truth is yet to still be determined. Uhh ohh. If you wish to claim inevitability here, then you deny free will .

[Optimism]

Undetermined truth cannot be absolute.

OHSHI- did I just blow your mind?

You are asserting a truth claim based on the existence or non-existence of a place. What if this place has yet to be created (may or may not be created)?



\kiss your free-will good bye.

Is it absolute truth that I will cross the street tomorrow? Undetermined truth cannot be absolute. If it is, then you and I lack free will. So, if you want to propose we have no free will, the truth is absolute. If a deity does exist, then truth is absolute. If a deity does not exist, then truth remains relative...oh shit, I just grew philosophically.

This hasn't happened for over a year. Sweet Xd.

[Xrow]

Undetermined truth cannot be absolute.

...Wow.

So gravity didn't absolutely exist until Newton determined it to exist?

[Optimism]

Undetermined truth cannot be absolute.

...Wow.

So gravity didn't absolutely exist until Newton determined it to exist?

Read my edit. I just had a revelation extending my philosophical persepctive...

Awesome.

If you claim that an uncreated creator created everything, then he can create more things. Undetermined truths. In other words, everything that exists now isn't everything to ever exist.

LOL, WOW I OWN.

King, I now revoke my entire statement regarding relative and absolute truth. Whether truth is relative or absolute is purely dependent on an omnipotent, omniscient deity existing.

[Xrow]

That doesn't make sense. Reword it.



You have a very VERY skewed perspective of truth.
You either absolutely WILL cross the street tomorrow, or you absolutely WILL NOT.
Gravity ABSOLUTELY EXISTED before Newton discovered it, and it still ABSOLUTELY EXISTS.
Try applying this to every aspect of life -- you will find that it can be applied literally anywhere and still hole true.

Heres a more simple example for you, little one:
The vast majority of the world has not determined your existence, yet you still absolutely exist, no?

[Optimism]

In other words, relative truth exists because of undetermined truth. For instance, your belief of a heaven or hell under the prospect that neither have come to fruition yet. If this is true, then speculation may occur and thus, truth is absolute. However, if you submit to me that free will doesn't exist, then I will allot you the point that all truth is absolute. So, there are two options. A deity exists -- no free will/absolute truth. A deity doesn't exist -- free will/relative truth, i.e., I can cross the street tomorrow or I may not. Undetermined truth=speculative=relative.

[Xrow]

That doesn't make sense. Reword it.



You have a very VERY skewed perspective of truth.
You either absolutely WILL cross the street tomorrow, or you absolutely WILL NOT.
Gravity ABSOLUTELY EXISTED before Newton discovered it, and it still ABSOLUTELY EXISTS.
Try applying this to every aspect of life -- you will find that it can be applied literally anywhere and still hole true.

Heres a more simple example for you, little one:
The vast majority of the world has not determined your existence, yet you still absolutely exist, no?

[Optimism]

That doesn't make sense. Reword it.



You have a very VERY skewed perspective of truth.
You either absolutely WILL cross the street tomorrow, or you absolutely WILL NOT.
Gravity ABSOLUTELY EXISTED before Newton discovered it, and it still ABSOLUTELY EXISTS.
Try applying this to every aspect of life -- you will find that it can be applied literally anywhere and still hole true.

Heres a more simple example for you, little one:
The vast majority of the world has not determined your existence, yet you still absolutely exist, no?

If absolute truth exists, then we all have a very, very small percent chance of being valid in our beliefs. Hell, we may not have even thought of the absolute truth yet, which is a strange thought. Given that the "evidence" currently understood regarding our universe, it is very plausible that we don't know this truth.

I maintain my unknowing state -- to claim otherwise would be foolish.

I agree. Truth is absolute.

[Xrow]

Thank you.
And yes, it is quite a scary thought :\ It is very possible that neither of out beliefs are absolutely true.

[Optimism]

Thank you.
And yes, it is quite a scary thought :\ It is very possible that neither of out beliefs are absolutely true.

So then why refute atheist agnosticism? Why not take the plunge into the unknown with me and simply submit that it is beyond our capacity to know this absolute truth? Religion is disprovable. Why not benefit humanity without religion? It is possible. I strive for this every day. If what you want from religion is simply an eternal life, then please, consider other options. Most likely, this is the only life that you will have. Why be against gays or restrict the rights of others because of a belief that may or may not be truth?

In other words, why not adhere to a morality that is of greater caliber than Jehova's? Enslavement/anti-gay? Really? We, as humans are better than this god.

[grant746]

this is spam

[Optimism]

this is spam

I will kill you.